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 Post subject: Re: Planurile Alfa Romeo
PostPosted: 01 Dec 2009, 22:50 
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Vesti foarte ingrijoratoare au fost publicate astazi pe Automotive News,din lipsa de timp dau un c&p , articolul original este disponibil doar celor abonati.
Quote:
Alfa faces product freeze under a review of the struggling brand
Luca Ciferri
Automotive News Europe
December 1, 2009 15:25 CET

TURIN -- Fiat S.p.A. could freeze new investment in Alfa Romeo under a strategic review of the money-losing brand ordered by CEO Sergio Marchionne.



A product freeze is one of two alternatives that Fiat is considering to end years of losses and declining sales at its sporty premium brand.

The other option is to refresh Alfa's lineup using Chrysler platforms to replace the aging Alfa 159 sedan and wagon and the discontinued 166 flagship sedan.

Alfa's new-car sales have declined steeply in the past decade as its range became older and new products were delayed.

Now it seems that Marchionne is losing patience with the struggling brand.

Marchionne has ordered a review of Alfa to find out whether to allow the marque a final rebirth through Fiat's alliance with Chrysler or to leave the brand as it is with no new substantial investments after the introduction of the Giulietta lower-medium car in 2010.

"We need to work a lot harder on Alfa to make an intelligent decision that effectively preserves the highest possible value to Fiat," Marchionne told Automotive News Europe in an interview at Fiat's headquarters here.

Too many reinventions

Marchionne said Alfa had undergone too many reinventions.

"We need to stop doing it. You cannot be a newborn Christian every four years. It's the same religion, eventually you need to own a religion and carry it to conclusion," he said.

The two options for Alfa are:

• Replacing the 159 with a D-segment sedan and the 166 with an E-segment sedan built in North America on Chrysler platforms, but unique to Alfa and sold by Alfa worldwide.

• Freezing investment in the brand after the 147 hatchback is replaced by the Giulietta. This means that the 166 will not be replaced, leaving the brand with the Giulietta and the MiTo, Alfa's first small car, as its only fresh models. The rest of the Alfa range -- the 159, the Brera coupe, the Spider and the GT coupe will continue to be sold.

Last year, Alfa sold 103,000 new cars compared with 203,000 in 2000. The brand has lost between 200 million and 400 million euros a year in the past 10 years, sources said. Fiat does not release separate financial results for any of its brands.

Marchionne said Fiat's alliance with Chrysler could allow a high level of commonality between Alfa and the Chrysler platforms for the replacement of the 159 and 166, which was discontinued in 2007.

"Certainly the availability of D and E segment (platforms) in the United States which are capable of being Alfa Romeoized is there. We need to look at the economics of that opportunity," Marchionne said.

No Alfa-Dodge merger

Marchionne is expected to announce the future of Alfa early next year, when the Italian automaker presents its 2010 to 2014 business plan.

"By then we will know a lot more about what those architectures in the U.S. are capable of doing for Alfa," Marchionne said.

He said Alfa will not integrate with Chrysler's Dodge brand, which has been speculated in some press reports.

"The heritage of the Alfa and Dodge brands is completely different, the DNA is completely different. We would lose a lot of the appeal of Alfa Romeo if we try to Americanize it through a merger with Dodge," Marchionne said.

Marchionne said he is pleased with the Mito, which was introduced in July 2008, and the Giulietta, which is due in March 2010.

These two new products "are going to do a lot in advancing the DNA and the quality of the (Alfa) brand," he said.

Past failures

Fiat tried to reinvent Alfa with the introduction of the 156 in 1997. The 156 was hailed as a great-looking car. It had a platform specific to Alfa and was a huge success. Sales peaked at almost 120,000 units in 2000, but the 156 did not lead to an Alfa turnaround because no truly successful products followed it.

The 156-based 147 hatchback got off a good start after its launch in 2000 with over 100,000 units sold from 2001 to 2003.

But the arrival of German premium offerings such as the new Audi A3 in 2003 and the BMW 1-series in 2004 hit sales, forcing Alfa to lower the 147 market positioning to rival the VW Golf, a move that failed to halt the 147's sales slide.

In 2005, Fiat tried another reinvention for Alfa with the 159, Brera and Spider range.

These cars were based on a new platform but were plagued by excessive weight and low quality that always kept sales well below initial expectations of 120,000 units a year.

Sales of the 159, Brera and Spider range peaked at almost 80,000 units in 2007.


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 Post subject: Re: Planurile Alfa Romeo
PostPosted: 01 Dec 2009, 23:20 
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Nu suna deloc bine :samui:
Sper ca nu se va intampla ca in 2003 cand au redus bugetele de productie si au facut compromisuri majore privind calitatea materialelor.
Nu cred ca vor mai cunoaste prea curand succesul pe care l-au avut cu lansarea modelului 156.

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 Post subject: Re: Planurile Alfa Romeo
PostPosted: 02 Dec 2009, 00:59 
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suna trist. cred ca este o legatura cu deprecierea accelerata pe care o sufera toate modelele AR, fata de cele ale concurentei. oricat de pasionat ai fi de o marca de masini, esti putin kamikaze dpdv financiar sa-ti permiti o pierdere la un autoturism nou de 60-70% in 5-6 ani de folosinta. pentru cumparatorul cu buget limitat AR este mai atractiva sh decat noua, iar pentru producator, piata sh e irelevanta. am vazut acum doua zile pe un site de licitatii 159 1.8 0 km la 12000 excl VAT si asta spune multe.

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ex: Alfa Romeo 159 1.9 jtd grigio vesuvio
ex: Alfa Romeo 166 Super 2.0 tb grigio chiaro metallizzato
ex: Alfa Romeo 156 1.8 ts rosso proteo


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 Post subject: Re: Planurile Alfa Romeo
PostPosted: 02 Dec 2009, 02:47 
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era de asteptat intrucatva. nu poti sa scapi nesanctionat de piata cu modele aparute inainte de 2k in vreme ce competitorii inoveaza din ce in ce mai mult. MiTo va aduce ceva bani la buget, e o masina cu priza la public, sunt insa sceptic in ceea ce priveste 149-le. Vor urma vremuri tulburi ptr. Alfa, clar, ambele variante sunt dezastruoase :( insa Marchionne cred ca e constient ca daca va cunoaste un oarecare reviriment cu modelele mici si nu va inlocui la timp iarasi clasa mare tot in impas va fi. Cred ca vom avea in cele din urma 'Alfele mari' facute pe platforme Chrysler.

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 Post subject: Re: Planurile Alfa Romeo
PostPosted: 02 Dec 2009, 05:48 
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FIAT a ingropat Alfa si acum nu stie pe unde sa scoata camasa . Vreti sa va dau eu un scenariu mult mai trist ? Nu , nu vreti si nici eu nu vreau . Numai ca imi bazaie nasol in minte cum suna Rover in chineza .
:bash:

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 Post subject: Re: Planurile Alfa Romeo
PostPosted: 02 Dec 2009, 12:37 
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Quote:
FIAT a ingropat Alfa si acum nu stie pe unde sa scoata camasa . Vreti sa va dau eu un scenariu mult mai trist ? Nu , nu vreti si nici eu nu vreau . Numai ca imi bazaie nasol in minte cum suna Rover in chineza .
:bash:
Corect!

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 Post subject: Re: Planurile Alfa Romeo
PostPosted: 04 Dec 2009, 02:22 
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E un articol interesant si pe italiaspeed, nu pot sa dau link, il gasiti rapid. Parca spun asa voalat sa ne luam gindu de la revirimentul acestei marci, punctind ca incercind sa o ffaca un concurent pentru premium DE (in special bmw) a cam esuat si ca va trebui sa se orienteze spre piata mai ieftina. Un lucru destul de corect, daca dau bani de bmw/vag pe ea, vreau SA NU SE STRICE si sa scirtiie pe interior si sa se degradeze ca o bucata de carne la soare.


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 Post subject: Re: Planurile Alfa Romeo
PostPosted: 04 Dec 2009, 03:46 
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n-am citit articolul de pe italiaspeed, dar tin sa te contrazic: Alfa nu vine la pret de BMW. acum poate ca sunt eu 'delusional', dar ultima oara cand am verificat preturile, Alfa era mult mai ieftina decat BMW la acelasi grad de echipare.
VAG-ul e si el marginal mai scump decat Alfa. Ba inca chiar o marca ca Skoda vine la pret de Alfa. Daca la vag te referi si la Audi, e aceeasi poveste ca si BMW. Audi e mult mai scump ca Alfa la acelasi grad de echipare. daca in Rom, Alfa vine la pret de BMW sau Audi atunci nu trebuie blamat grupul per se.

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 Post subject: Re: Planurile Alfa Romeo
PostPosted: 04 Dec 2009, 12:55 
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IRBabuin Quote:
Un lucru destul de corect, daca dau bani de bmw/vag pe ea, vreau SA NU SE STRICE si sa scirtiie pe interior si sa se degradeze ca o bucata de carne la soare.
I feel you :console:

Cred ca problema asta este valabila pentru majoritatea Alfelor - am citit de 156, 147 si 159
mobyle Quote:
AR este mai atractiva sh decat noua
Cred si eu: din moment ce ai aceleasi probleme cu ea si noua si sh, de ce sa nu platesti de 3 ori mai putin?! :scratch:

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 Post subject: Re: Planurile Alfa Romeo
PostPosted: 07 Dec 2009, 20:52 
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http://www.alvolante.it/news/alfa_romeo ... -124771044" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

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Ex: Crosswagon
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 Post subject: Re: Planurile Alfa Romeo
PostPosted: 07 Dec 2009, 21:28 
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Mai sunt mai multe poze spy interesante pe alvolante.it: http://www.alvolante.it/news/spy/lettor ... o_milano_1" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

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Ex: Crosswagon
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 Post subject: Re: Planurile Alfa Romeo
PostPosted: 08 Dec 2009, 20:32 
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Interesante vestile din ultima vreme, Marcoaeone zice ca viitorul AR si Lancia nu este garantat. Se cam stia ca preluarea Chrysler o sa ii bage in galeata, ei nu stiau oare?


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 Post subject: Re: Planurile Alfa Romeo
PostPosted: 09 Dec 2009, 01:33 
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Cateva intrebari se ridica atunci,ce ati prefera :
1.Alfa sa fie lasata in voia sortii,sa nu se mai investeasca in modele noi, incetul cu incetul sa fie lasata sa moara,si sa ne impacam cu ideea ca noi conducem ultimele tipuri de Alfe produse ?
2.Alfa sa supravietuiasca producand doar Fiat/Chrysler cu alta emblema ?
3.Brandul Alfa (pentru ca fabrica,centrul de design etc, nu mai exista ) sa fie vandut unui producator ambitios dornic de expansiune mondiala,din ... sud-estul Asiei ?

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156 SW 2.0 JTS
166 2.4 JTD TI
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 Post subject: Re: Planurile Alfa Romeo
PostPosted: 09 Dec 2009, 02:30 
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greselile se platesc intotdeauna. nu poti scapa ca firma inlocuind modele la 10 ani. cu modele mai slabe decat concurenta.
Alfa va trebui sa se umileasca ptr. a regasi stralucirea trecutului. Cred ca singura sansa e sa produca modele pe platforme Fiat/Chrysler. nu vad alta solutie. nu poti recupera timpul pierdut batand din palme. sunt ptr. optiunea 2.
Asia e un no-go dupa parerea mea. odata trecuta granita acolo, va fi Alfa's undoing, nu va mai depasi stadiul de kia (in cel mai bun caz). Asteapta sa vezi ce se va intampla cu Jaguarul.
Platformele Chrysler poate sunt rele ptr. puristi dar pot garanta costuri scazute de productie si implicit preturi mai populare. Volkswagen's way. Cu un management competitiv poti reveni in 10-15 ani in gama premium.
LE: cat despre Lancia slabe sperante. Lanciile mici pot supravietui bine, insa de la Delta in sus sunt doar modele ptr. excentrici. Lybra mi s-a parut intotdeauna o masina de arhitect care asculta 'fugile' lui Bach la volan. It's not going to win you any money innit (sic)!

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 Post subject: Re: Planurile Alfa Romeo
PostPosted: 11 Dec 2009, 00:41 
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VW interesata de Alfa

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 Post subject: Re: Planurile Alfa Romeo
PostPosted: 11 Dec 2009, 00:57 
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Nu reiese de acolo ca VW ar fi interesata de Alfa.
Ce timpuri traim,acum ceva timp as fi considerat asta o blasfemie,acum o consider salvarea Alfei Romeo. :(


L.E. - alt link,dar ziarul e pe abonament si devine inactiv,dupa mai mult de 5 clickuri banuiesc.
Si sa nu-i uitam pe Da Silva si De Meo ! :scratch:

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 Post subject: Re: Planurile Alfa Romeo
PostPosted: 11 Dec 2009, 01:42 
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Quote:
Other industry experts not a thousand miles away from Turin go even further and suggest that VW has been interested in Alfa Romeo for some time. Alfa Romeo could help reinvigorate VW’s underperforming Spanish brand Seat – which VW in the past said it wanted to transform into “a Mediterranean, emotional, sporting brand” like Alfa Romeo.
Quote:
Mr Piëch is in buying mode and VW is on a roll. After Porsche and Suzuki and perhaps MAN, Alfa Romeo – if the Italian marque fails to perform to Mr Marchionne’s exacting standards – could also end up in two or three years’ time in VW’s fold. That would raise another interesting question.

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 Post subject: Re: Planurile Alfa Romeo
PostPosted: 11 Dec 2009, 02:30 
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eu zic sa vanda alfa, fiat si lancia la vw iar ei sa ramana cu ferrari si maserati daca doar atat sunt in stare sa tina pe plus :bash:

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Ex: 159 SW 2.4 JTD Q-tronic
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 Post subject: Re: Planurile Alfa Romeo
PostPosted: 11 Dec 2009, 18:22 
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Alfa se produce de 20 de ani pe arhitectura Fiat cu mici contributii de la structurile din trecutul marcii. Ultimile Alfa Romeo care mai pastrau ceva din istoria marcii ante Fiat sunt cele motorizate cu V6 Arese (2.0 Turbo, 2,5, 3.0 si 3.2). Varianta 2 propusa de Marius aduce nou doar platformele Chrysler pentru ca Fiat conducem deja cu alta sigla de vreo 20 de ani.

Apropos de Jaguar... un real succes dupa ce a fost preluat de indieni. Jaguar este mai tanar ca nici o data, are platforma tehnica proprie, are fabrica si centru de design... este mult mai mult decat doar o marca comerciala si acum are mult mai multe sanse de a vinde in competitia cu nemtii.

Prefer sa cumpar o Alfa construita de la zero cu capital chinezesc sau indian decat sa platesc in continuare in plus pentru un Trade Mark care dedesupt este un Fiat sau eventual un WV. As cumpara o Alfa finantata de un nene cu nume de cantec de cioara daca s-ar construi in continuare in Italia, intr-o fabrica noua, in serii reduse si cu performante sportive. Un fel de Lotus sau TVR sau Pagani dar la scoruri mai pamantene. As cumpara ca cetatean roman asa ceva doar daca nu se intampla ce scrie aici http://forum.alfaclub.ro/viewtopic.php? ... 98#p130198 ;)

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-------------------------------------
Alfa Romeo 159 1.9 JTDm 120 CP
Alfa Romeo GTV V6 3.2 270CP
Alfa Romeo 147 1.9 JTD 101CP
Alfa Romeo 33 boxer 1.7 16V QV 140CP
Ex. Alfa Romeo GTV V6 2.0 Turbo 240CP


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 Post subject: Re: Planurile Alfa Romeo
PostPosted: 13 Dec 2009, 13:40 
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din ce stiu si ce e sigur vw a cumparat 20% din suzuki , asa ca nu cred ca vor actiona si la fiat, cel putin nu asa curand.

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 Post subject: Re: Planurile Alfa Romeo
PostPosted: 15 Dec 2009, 17:36 
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http://www.automarket.ro/stiri/presedin ... 27115.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; :clapping: :clapping: :clapping:


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 Post subject: Re: Planurile Alfa Romeo
PostPosted: 23 Dec 2009, 18:31 
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Vestea buna - se va produce 8C GTA.
Vestea proasta - nimic altceva nou pe langa. :evil:


Attachments:
Planurile grupului Fiat.JPG
Planurile grupului Fiat.JPG [ 31.62 KiB | Viewed 2283 times ]

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156 SW 2.0 JTS
166 2.4 JTD TI
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 Post subject: Re: Planurile Alfa Romeo
PostPosted: 23 Dec 2009, 23:56 
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Veste buna? De ce, planuiesti sa-ti cumperi una? :lol:

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 Post subject: Re: Planurile Alfa Romeo
PostPosted: 29 Dec 2009, 12:36 
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salut
in primul rind fiat si crysler sunt in alta clasa si este scump sa produca masini fiat pe arhitectura crysler si invers
in al doilea rind crysler are masini mari cu care fiat nu are ce sa faca pt ca la ei ceam mai mare este linea cred si invers deci singura arhitectura comuna ar fi platorma de linea si una de la crysler asa ca au nevoie de alfa pentru ca este pe aceeasi marime cu fiat si pot sa faca ceva in comun
in al treilea rind vw are o marca sport (seat) ca sa cumpere alfa mai intii trebuie sa scape de seat cu care oricum a dat-o in bara

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 Post subject: Re: Planurile Alfa Romeo
PostPosted: 04 Jan 2010, 13:37 
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Quote:
Fiat S.p.A. CEO Sergio Marchionne outlined plans for the automakers' plants in Italy that he said would require hefty investments and labor flexibility. He confirmed auto production would stop at the Termini Imerese plant in Sicily in December 2011 and suggested production of its Panda small car could move to a plant in Pomigliano d'Arco plant, near Naples, southern Italy.
"Building the future Panda at Pomigliano would guarantee very high volumes ... (but) you are talking about a radical intervention which would require huge resources," Marchionne said Dec. 22.
Fiat produces 650,000 cars a year in Italy at its five plants, with 22,000 workers out of a total work force in the country of about 30,000, according to Marchionne's presentation.

The following are key details of Fiat's plans:

MIRAFIORI, Turin (Started producing in 1939)

Work force: 5,840

Production: about 178,000 vehicles in 2009

Current Models/Products: Fiat Punto, Idea, Multipla; Alfa Romeo MiTo; Lancia Musa.

Plans:

-- Cut production of Fiat Punto and Multipla

-- Add production of Fiat LO 5 seater, Fiat LO 7 seater

-- Reorganize plant to install a new production line

-- Improve logistics for component delivery

TERMINI IMERESE, Palermo (production started in 1970)

Work force: 1,400

Models/Products: Lancia Ypsilon

Plans:

-- End car production in December, 2011

GIAMBATTISTA VICO, Pomigliano, Naples (production started in 1968)

Work force: 5,200

Production: about 36,000 vehicles in 2009

Current Models/Products: Alfa Romeo 147, GT, 159 Berlina, 159 Sportwagon.

Plans:

-- Introduce Panda production, currently at 290,000 units

-- will cost "hundreds and hundreds of millions of euros"

-- will mean more temporary layoffs

-- needs investment of 40 million euros for retraining

-- "flexibility" in work force needed to meet demand changes

CASSINO, Frosinone (production started in 1972)

Work force: 4,300

Production: about 105,000 units in 2009

Models/Products: Fiat Croma, Bravo; Lancia Delta.

Plans:

-- Fiat Croma to end production

-- New Alfa Giulietta to be produced here

MELFI, Potenza (production started in 1993)

Work force: 5,280

Production: about 280,000 units in 2009

Current Models/Products: Fiat Grande Punto, Punto Evo.

Plans:

-- Both models to continue, but mix will shift toward newer Punto Evo

Sursa : Automotive News.

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